Inside the Hall - Latest Comments in Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

mamalickaboobooday — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 18:08:10 -0000

Who are you? I belive you know me b/c you are trying to bust my balls...which I am very much appreciative of. Unmask thyself dear friend. You're someone in b-town, yes, but not much else is revealed...

Who art thou???

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

keithr812 — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 17:03:54 -0000

MAMALICKABOOBOODAY ,AFTER READING YOUR COMMENT, IT LOOKS LIKE YOU COULD HAVE PAID A LITTLE MORE ATTENTION IN ENGLISH. I'VE SEEN 3RD GRADERS WHO CAN PUT FULL SENTENCES TOGETHER. AND JUST SO YOU KNOW, ITS SPELLED THERE, NOT THE. COME ON MAN SERIOUSLY.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

keithr812 — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 16:49:58 -0000

MY ONLY COMMENT IS I CAN'T BELIEVE THERE'S ACTUALLY A PHOTO THAT CAPTURES HOW MUCH OF A DOUCHEBAG MYLES BRAND REALLY IS. I'D STILL LIKE TO FIND THIS "man" IN A DARK ALLEY SOMEWHERE AND INTRODUCE HIS ANUS TO MY SIZE 13.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

bz — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 14:27:34 -0000

a. i'll look at their resume, but if it only says high school, it gets weeded out.

b. it's not solely their age at all. i specifically said that it was because of their experience. it just so happens that because they are young, they don't happen to have that experience. it is my right as an employer to require a certain amount of experience.

you are right in that the union has a certain amount of power in whether or not this happens, but the fact of the matter is that the nba does have the right to require a certain amount of experience outside of high school.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BGleas — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 10:37:30 -0000

Exactly, and for every Brad Miller there's 1,000 Todd Fuller's.

But the basic point is still that for every Kobe there isn't a DeAngelo Collins. I noted above that since 1995 (KG's draft year) 37 high school players have been drafted, and 31 were on a roster, plus Jonathan Bender would be if he hadn't gotten injured. 31-out-of-37 have remained in the league, that's an absurdly high rate.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

NotTheRealSteveEyl — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 07:54:39 -0000

You may turn down people every day, but if you did it:
A. before interviewing them or even seeing their resume
B. solely on the basis of their age (after they are emancipated adults), you might be in a little legal trouble

I think the answer is the union and the CBA, not the employer's right to hire/fire....

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

bahickma — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 04:57:46 -0000

I completely agree with you B. When Monta Ellis and Martell Webster declared for the NBA Draft out of my high school class I thought they were nuts, and they are decent contributors in the NBA. While not all of the guys who made the leap from high school to the pros panned out quite like they had hoped, there are still a significant number who did make a difference in the game.

And the argument that for every Kobe there's a DeAngelo Collins really doesn't matter. You could say the same thing about good college players. For every Tim Duncan there's a Trajan Langdon.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

bz — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 21:15:14 -0000

playing in the nba is a PRIVILAGE not a right. there is no law that says an employer HAS to employ someone or that someone HAS to be employed. that's capitalism. i turn people down for jobs every day. it's not their right to work for me, it's a privilege. this in turn makes it my privilege to employee who i wish.

certainly it would behoove me to employ the best and most talented, but sometimes the best and the most talented aren't necessarily the same person. i can hire a kid straight out of high school, but there is a lot i'm going to have to teach him. he may have raw skills, but he doesn't have the experience of being in this position before, and he most likely won't have a developed business acumen or an understanding of common business principles. i also will question his ability to represent my company when put on the spot. in short, he may become my best salesperson, but he's not going to be for a while. most business people would rather hire a kid out of college who is more likely to succeed sooner rather than later. he's still going to take some polishing, but only a couple of months, not years. i can take the best and the brightest right out of high school, but i'm going to have to educate them on my own dime and time. see any parallels?

everybody's favorite success stories are bryant, mcgrady, and garnett (lebron doesn't count because he is in a league of his own). those three weren't anything more that sixth or seventh men their first two years in the league. it wasn't until their third year that they because starters and started posting the numbers that we are used to today.

nba owners and gm's have established a practice of hiring kids straight out of college who don't have the experience, acumen, or savvy to contribute in the same way that they can contribute after if they had attended college, but the thought of losing out on that potential is something there are willing to pay for.

this age rule has come about because there is more talent in the association that ever before and gm's/owners feel like they can afford to miss out on the potential because of all of the options that will give them immediate returns. a day will come when there isn't enough talent to go around and they will look for ways to get around the rule in order to get the best talent back to the association.

edit: sorry that was so long. these fingers just kept on going.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

gogoiu — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 21:12:40 -0000

Most of these guys major in "Sports and Leisure Management" (in other words - basketball). They either make the pros or manage shuffleboard tournaments at an old folks home. Let them try to make some money earlier.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BGleas — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 20:30:18 -0000

I'm not trying to hammer you on this, it's just that I really think you're wrong on this. You just named Kobe, tracy and KG in your example...That's three different versions of "For every Kobe".

I've worked with some of these guys and I can attest personally that these guys learn way more practicing a full season in the NBA than they ever would playing in college. And like I pointed out above a vast majority of these guys pan out, especially when you compare them to the rate of college players that pan out.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

sierracoach — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:58:52 -0000

Stern and Brand can ponder whatever they want but it doesn't matter until and unless the players union agrees to it in the next collective bargaining agreement--which won't be until at least 2011 (unless the NBA exercises its 1-year option, in which case the current CBA won't expire until 2012).

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BGleas — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:50:29 -0000

I still disagree. Not trying to split hairs, but I think 9 out of the 37 have played in anAll-Star game. You could also argue that Al Jefferson, Josh Smith and Monta Ellis all have a legitimate shot at one day playing in one. That's 12 out of 37 players or 32 percent. That's a huge rate of a group of players making an All-Stare game.

I'm not a big John Hollinger fan, but I believe he's done some statistics that prove that direct to high school players are overwhelmingly more successful than players that went to college.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

kgork — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:24:06 -0000

You know because you can't develop these in the NBA

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BTOWN40 — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:22:16 -0000

Bad suggestion the college game would end up looking like a league just above the high school level,

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BTOWN40 — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:19:06 -0000

Probably because the exposure and hype for a player are in college. Someone that goes to Europe or the NBDL may be forgotten about if the don't perform well

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

ALH_00 — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 19:03:31 -0000

It may hurt the level of play some (which has been outstanding this year imo), but college basketball (esp. at IU, Kentucky, UNC, UCLA, KU, etc...) is about tradition; it's about the school; it's about rivalry and pride. The students, alumni, and to a lesser extent the general fan base, will always support college athletics in general and basketball at IU in particular. I don't think any form of professional basketball can diminish the importance of IU v. Purdue, or IU v. Kentucky, or UNC v. Duke, or [insert rivalry here], because it is as much about the uniforms, pagentry, rivalry and fans as it is the players. For example, ND went 3-9 last year in Football...but, try to get a ND ticket from the box office for this fall.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

ALH_00 — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:47:44 -0000

knowing nothing for certain, I would think that the NBA can set whatever restrictions it decides prudent...of course with the approval of the owners and the players association. It is a self-governing association of teams that can make whatever rules it pleases regarding who is eligible to participate in its league.

Again, I have no law or facts to back that up, so I welcome a more clear explanation as well.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

JerryCT — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:47:19 -0000

Tennis used to be clearly divided between amateur and professional with the amateur game the one people liked the most. Today I think people prefer the college basketball product over the NBA product.

What worries me is if there is a 2or 3+year rule , more good players will go to the NBDL instead of college. If true the it will hurt the college game not help it just like tprofessional tennis killed the interest in amateur tennis.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:21:55 -0000

Some do stay in college too long like Hibbert

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:20:59 -0000

Not so much. i haven;t seend 2 Kobe's, Tracy's and KG's, From the last 2 years of the draft where they let Highschool kids in there were almost 20 that entered the draft. more oft than not they hang around for at least a couple years or so or go to Europe. I think we are getting caught up in symantecs. What we are saying is they might be able to extend their careers or bring them up a level possibly with 2 years of college.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:14:07 -0000

man I saw you calling out ppl further up and I knew you would make your way down to me. DAMN IT. Lol. 4 years yeah I do. 2 years possibly some. Depending on who he had as a coach. Im not saying saying he sucks or isn't one of the best lol. I', m just saying it would of possibly added that part to his game.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:11:36 -0000

yeah but you get scholarships for Atheltics and Grades. If they use their 2 of their years of their athletic scholarship and decide to get an agent and try the draft then thats on them. We shouldn't give out a second chance scholarship for makign a bad decision. They know the rules and consequences.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

tacojohn — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:09:21 -0000

Actually, for every Lenny Cooke, Korleone Young, and DeAngelo Collins, there are TWO Kobe Bryants, Tracy McGradys and Kevin Garnetts.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:07:43 -0000

yeah i remembered he was going ot come then wanted to go to NBA and wasn;t projected then deceided on Europe. That was odd.

Re: Stern and Brand ponder new age limit rule

BrianK — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:06:40 -0000

Thats what I said lol. They stay around a couple years. Theres a difference between staying around a couple years and being a Kobe. i agree with getting a second contract. They do tend to make money stay a couple years nad/or go to Europe. But what IM saying is if they developed more in college then they would possibly have better chance of extending their careers in pros.